Smokin-It User Forum!
Recipes => Beef => Topic started by: gregbooras on May 23, 2015, 06:52:15 PM
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I have a 8 lb. flat choice brisket that I will be starting tomorrow for Tuesday's dinner. The plan is to brine and the inject and then smoke away.
Here is my plan of attack:
Modified 5/24/2015, I will post final results and recipe once I finishing smoking!
*Note this is a work in progress and after chatting on the forum with Arnie about salt levels I have change the recipe for the injection and brine.
Brine Ingredients:
96 oz. water
3/4 cup fine sea salt
½ cup brown sugar
8 cups ice
3 oz. fine sea salt
1/4 brown sugar
1/2 gallon water
1 t #1 cure
Brisket Injection
2 ½ T Minor’s Au Jus Prep
1 cup Moore's Marinade
1 T hot sauce
32 oz. beef stock
4 Cups Water
4 T Minor's Au Jus Prep
1 T Cholula Chipotle Hot Sauce.
Wood:
3.5 oz. Acadian Oak
2 oz. Hickory
.5 oz. Mesquite
Make the Aus Jus sauce according to package, mix in the rest of ingredients and simmer for 15 min. Let cool before injecting.
Use the extra marinade left over for dipping sauce.
Rub - Use my rub mixture (or your favorite low salt will work)
Brine overnight, then inject, rub and then place back in refrigerator until ready to smoke Monday night.
Smoke at 225 degrees until it hits 195 degrees pull wrap and then place in a cooler with towels for 2 hours.
(https://www.smokinitforums.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi375.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Foo191%2Fgregbooras%2Fbrisket_zpsa3si40f2.jpg&hash=5c00e14ca65358aede22e7fcd19005f533cb3df6) (http://s375.photobucket.com/user/gregbooras/media/brisket_zpsa3si40f2.jpg.html)
Greg
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Looks like a plan Greg. Just a bit of caution in the salt content from the brine, Moores, the Au Jus and the beef stock. This is something I learned from experience. Take a close look at all the salt.
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Looks like a plan Greg. Just a bit of caution in the salt content from the brine, Moores, the Au Jus and the beef stock. This is something I learned from experience. Take a close look at all the salt.
Arnie,
Excellent point on the salt, without the brine I think it was would be fine, but I could also use water instead of the beef stock. I think I will make up a batch today and see how it tastes....
Moore's 29 percent
Au Jus 13 %
Beef Stock 18 %
I wonder if I should skip the brine and just inject and leave overnight?
Thoughts....
Thanks Greg
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I am a rookie smoker, but already I have found that brining and rubbing = salty taste. I looking for more info on this subject--so am watching for comments. Looking forward to doing my first brisket--can't wait to hear the results of this smoke.
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I am a rookie smoker, but already I have found that brining and rubbing = salty taste. I looking for more info on this subject--so am watching for comments. Looking forward to doing my first brisket--can't wait to hear the results of this smoke.
Dale,
I find most store bought rubs have to much salt for my taste. Making your own is easy and you can elect not to use salt.
Greg
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Dale
I use a dalmatian rub, equal parts kosher salt and course black pepper. I apply a light coating on the brisket and thats it. You could add lemon pepper, onion powder or garlic powder if you want a slightly different flavor profile.
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Does anyone use a drip pan to catch juices when doing Briskets?
Thanks Greg
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You also are using rub which probably has salt. As you know, Greg, the time spent in brine and the time spent after injecting also contributes to the saltiness. You might consider cutting the stock, and moores with half water. Maybe only use half the au jus also made with water. This way you can still get the flavor of everything with less salt. I think your rub has minimal salt, so I would load it up with rub to get that great bark. Just my opinion. I don't like over salted meat and have become very aware of the ingredients and salt content.
You could also cut it with apple juice.
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You also are using rub which probably has salt. As you know, Greg, the time spent in brine and the time spent after injecting also contributes to the saltiness. You might consider cutting the stock, and moores with half water. Maybe only use half the au jus also made with water. This way you can still get the flavor of everything with less salt. I think your rub has minimal salt, so I would load it up with rub to get that great bark. Just my opinion. I don't like over salted meat and have become very aware of the ingredients and salt content.
You could also cut it with apple juice.
Hey Arnie,
I decided I needed to taste test like I do when I cook anything...
So I ran five tests and then did a blind test with my wife on the sauce:
Test 1- 1 T Au Jus + 1 cup Water
Test 2- 1 T Au Jus + 1 cup Beef Stock
Test 3 - 1 T Au Jus + 1 t Moore's Marinade
Test 4 - 1 T Au Jus + 1 T Moore's Marinade
Test 5 - 1 T Au Jus + 1 Cup Water +2 Drops Hot Sauce
End result was that the beef stock and the Moore's did not make the final cut for the sauce.
I ended up with the following that I will use for my injections:
4 Cups Water
4 T Minor's Au Jus Prep
1 T Cholula Chipotle Hot Sauce.
(https://www.smokinitforums.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi375.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Foo191%2Fgregbooras%2Ftaste%2520test%2520injection_zpseemxebob.jpg&hash=e7e43a2238c27f411734f9cc2e3cea195fdf9b0d) (http://s375.photobucket.com/user/gregbooras/media/taste%20test%20injection_zpseemxebob.jpg.html)
(https://www.smokinitforums.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi375.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Foo191%2Fgregbooras%2Fbrisket%2520injection%2520sauce_zpsynhma0e1.jpg&hash=1fefaee8e1056d5a2b4a2efc35ca4d32cec1216e) (http://s375.photobucket.com/user/gregbooras/media/brisket%20injection%20sauce_zpsynhma0e1.jpg.html)
I have still not decided on the brine, thinking about that.... :)
Greg
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Good for you guys. It's great to have the partner involved. You folks obviously take cooking seriously. That was a great taste test and you probably have decided on a tasty solution...all puns intended. Apple juice is always a good substitute for water. A touch of sweetness and a hint of flavor.
Have a fantastic smoke!
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I used Divots brine and thought it was great. I use tender quick not #1 cure.
http://smokinitforums.com/index.php?topic=1012.0
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Dont skip the brine! The brine & injection combination makes the best brisket I have every had. Be cautious about the salt with the combination but dont skip that step. I have never had a complaint about salt content. On your next smoke drop one (inject or brine) & compare. I have only brined & only injected but neither was near as good as doing both. For those who havnt tried brineing & injecting, it really does elevate a great protien to something phenominal. It is the singular best thing I cook in the smoker, although my wife equally likes the smoked lobster.
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Dont skip the brine! The brine & injection combination makes the best brisket I have every had. Be cautious about the salt with the combination but dont skip that step. I have never had a complaint about salt content. On your next smoke drop one (inject or brine) & compare. I have only brined & only injected but neither was near as good as doing both. For those who havnt tried brineing & injecting, it really does elevate a great protien to something phenominal. It is the singular best thing I cook in the smoker, although my wife equally likes the smoked lobster.
Walt,
Thanks for the feedback, I will brine, but will cut back on the salt. Normally I use 8 oz of fine sea salt (3/4 cup) and brown sugar.
I think I will go with around 3 oz. of sea salt, 1/4 cup brown sugar and 1 t #1 cure..
Greg
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Greg,
Beef brisket can handle a good amount of salt...lots of firm muscle tissue there. I use my butt brine (which uses a cup of kosher salt), and injection that doesn't have much salt. The key to brining is to thoroughly rinse the meat when it comes out of the brine. A lot of people that find brined meat "too salty" skip that critical step! You have to get all the salt off the surface of the meat. The brine has done it's job, which is to modify the protein molecules near the surface of the meat, so no need for the excess brine.
I agree that the injection needs to be low-salt, but it's OK to have some salt in the rub. No need to let the brisket sit overnight with the rub on, post-brining. Just rinse, inject, rub and smoke!
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Greg,
Beef brisket can handle a good amount of salt...lots of firm muscle tissue there. I use my butt brine (which uses a cup of kosher salt), and injection that doesn't have much salt. The key to brining is to thoroughly rinse the meat when it comes out of the brine. A lot of people that find brined meat "too salty" skip that critical step! You have to get all the salt off the surface of the meat. The brine has done it's job, which is to modify the protein molecules near the surface of the meat, so no need for the excess brine.
I agree that the injection needs to be low-salt, but it's OK to have some salt in the rub. No need to let the brisket sit overnight with the rub on, post-brining. Just rinse, inject, rub and smoke!
Hey Tony,
I just got done cleaning up the brisket and will brine overnight. Then pull tomorrow and rinse and then back in the refrigerator until I am ready to inject and then apply the rub. Most likely put this on the smoker tomorrow night before bed.
I will keep you posted and thanks for the tips!
Greg
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Can't wait to see the results, Greg!
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Remove brisket from refrigerator and then pat dry, apply mustard and then rub. Add some olive oil and then some fine ground pepper.
(https://www.smokinitforums.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi375.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Foo191%2Fgregbooras%2Fready%2520for%2520smoker_zpso2zf2us2.jpg&hash=99438a0aac541df08a014d4fd6e6e34f3d577cd5) (http://s375.photobucket.com/user/gregbooras/media/ready%20for%20smoker_zpso2zf2us2.jpg.html)
(https://www.smokinitforums.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi375.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Foo191%2Fgregbooras%2Fsmoker%2520with%2520au%2520jus%2520pan_zpszzc9kciy.jpg&hash=f52ac45a50691de52e92270b44c68cfaf75c0df6) (http://s375.photobucket.com/user/gregbooras/media/smoker%20with%20au%20jus%20pan_zpszzc9kciy.jpg.html)
Back in the refrigerator until its time to smoke.
Greg
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Looking good Greg!
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Greg, the drip pan gave me a chuckle. ;D
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Greg, the drip pan gave me a chuckle. ;D
I am going to see if I can get some extra drippings for the sauce!
Greg
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Hope the drip pan works for you. That makes a great addition to a sauce.
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Greg, the drip pan gave me a chuckle. ;D
I am going to see if I can get some extra drippings for the sauce!
Greg
I just don't know if the brisket can aim. I'd add a couple more or a bigger pan.
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"I just don't know if the brisket can aim. I'd add a couple more or a bigger pan"
Agreed, brisket can't aim! lol... Maybe 2 pans with some space between to allow smoke/heat distribution. 8)
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"I just don't know if the brisket can aim. I'd add a couple more or a bigger pan"
Agreed, brisket can't aim! lol... Maybe 2 pans with some space between to allow smoke/heat distribution. 8)
Actually the pan was half full this morning, so not to bad of a aim :)
But it caught moistly fat so not what I was looking for, but an interesting test.
Greg
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Any update yet, Greg?
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We had friends over for dinner and the brisket was a huge success. I put the brisket in at 10:30 pm last night and it hit 195 degrees at 9:30 this morning. So I pulled it tippled wrapped in foil, set smoker to 140 degrees and left until 4:30 pm. Removed from smoker and placed a cooler for 1 hour and let sit 30 minutes before slicing. The taste was amazing, the smoke was just right and the brisket was tender. We all tried it with BBQ sauce and Au Jus, but I think the Au Jus was the best.
Along with the brisket we had homemade coleslaw and potato salad.
A bit more smoke ring then normal... but heck it tasted and looked great.
Thanks again for everyone's input here.
(https://www.smokinitforums.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi375.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Foo191%2Fgregbooras%2Fbrisket%2520finished_zpsxdjm1okr.jpg&hash=1b5accb4b4789894defb457857bfa45cb846b030) (http://s375.photobucket.com/user/gregbooras/media/brisket%20finished_zpsxdjm1okr.jpg.html)
(https://www.smokinitforums.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi375.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Foo191%2Fgregbooras%2Fbrisket%2520ready%2520carve_zpslqd6bn1d.jpg&hash=0423728fa291741beff87322e4c0129caf9e5280) (http://s375.photobucket.com/user/gregbooras/media/brisket%20ready%20carve_zpslqd6bn1d.jpg.html)
(https://www.smokinitforums.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi375.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Foo191%2Fgregbooras%2Fbrisket%2520cut_zps31wjonuo.jpg&hash=5480aee1c826a68a1590a2cf24f5b7eae4aa04a3) (http://s375.photobucket.com/user/gregbooras/media/brisket%20cut_zps31wjonuo.jpg.html)
(https://www.smokinitforums.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi375.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Foo191%2Fgregbooras%2Fbrisket%2520plated_zpsj2k2jdah.jpg&hash=6e76c33943c2a296c756fbab540cf6db96a9ff67) (http://s375.photobucket.com/user/gregbooras/media/brisket%20plated_zpsj2k2jdah.jpg.html)
Greg
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Nice job, Greg!! That ring shows how much the brine penetrates over time! Maybe could have brined less, but who cares if it tasted good! :D
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Nice job, Greg!! That ring shows how much the brine penetrates over time! Maybe could have brined less, but who cares if it tasted good! :D
It was a 12 hour brine with 1 t #1 cure, maybe go with 1/2 t or maybe even just 1/4 for the next smoke.
But the neighbors said, wow that looks good....... because of the ring.
First rule of cooking, make sure the food looks appealing, second rule of cooking, almost overriding rule number 1, make sure it tastes dam good :)
Greg
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Personally, I'd reduce the brine time on a cut that size. 12+ hours is good for a full packer (12+ lbs), but I'd do a flat that size about 8. It's not the amount of curing salt in a gradient brine, it's the length of the swim. If the brine penetrates about 1/4", it will have done its job. A brine, unless you're actually trying to cure the entire piece, like Canadian bacon, only needs to penetrate the surface a small amount to modify the protein molecules so it holds the moisture inside. Just my 2¢... Still looks great!
One more thing about length of time - since you aren't controlling the amount of salt, like with an equilibrium brine, too long of a brine time can really affect the saltiness of the interior meat, if it penetrates too deep.
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Personally, I'd reduce the brine time on a cut that size. 12+ hours is good for a full packer (12+ lbs), but I'd do a flat that size about 8. It's not the amount of curing salt in a gradient brine, it's the length of the swim. If the brine penetrates about 1/4", it will have done its job. A brine, unless you're actually trying to cure the entire piece, like Canadian bacon, only needs to penetrate the surface a small amount to modify the protein molecules so it holds the moisture inside. Just my 2¢... Still looks great!
One more thing about length of time - since you aren't controlling the amount of salt, like with an equilibrium brine, too long of a brine time can really affect the saltiness of the interior meat, if it penetrates too deep.
Tony,
I am not a fan of anything to salty, in a mix, soup, or in chips. You can always add salt, but once it is in the mix you are stuck with the taste. The salt level for this was perfect.
But I am not really sure what you mean by the following statement:
One more thing about length of time - since you aren't controlling the amount of salt, like with an equilibrium brine, too long of a brine time can really affect the saltiness of the interior meat, if it penetrates too deep.
For this brine (Brisket)
Brine ingredients:
½ gallon of water
3 oz. fine sea salt
¼ cup brown sugar
1 t (#1 cure)
For my butts I use the following brine and they look fine.
Brine Ingredients:
96 oz. water
3/4 cup fine sea salt
½ cup brown sugar
8 cups ice
1 t. #1 pink cure
(https://www.smokinitforums.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi375.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Foo191%2Fgregbooras%2Fpork%2520finished_zpstzuclrco.jpg&hash=cb34aa87d9fca49026bc8f330df6f35392818388) (http://s375.photobucket.com/user/gregbooras/media/pork%20finished_zpstzuclrco.jpg.html)
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Greg,
To have a better understanding of the different brining processes, read this (if you haven't):
Brines 101 (http://smokinitforums.com/index.php?topic=1504.0)
What I mean by "controlling the salt" is not that you aren't measuring it for your brine, but that you can't absolutely control the absorption rate, unless you use an equilibrium brine. Walt uses an equilibrium brine in his famous brined/injected recipe. You are using a gradient brine, which relies on time to control the absorption. It's not precise, and there's a lot of "black magic" in our gradient brine process. I gradient brine my butts and briskets, more for simplicity than anything else. But, I've also learned pretty good estimations of time. I use equilibrium brining for things like beef jerky, where I want very precise results every time, with no guess work.
Didn't mean to hijack your thread into a discussion on brining! But, since you asked... ;)
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Greg,
To have a better understanding of the different brining processes, read this (if you haven't):
Brines 101 (http://smokinitforums.com/index.php?topic=1504.0)
What I mean by "controlling the salt" is not that you aren't measuring it for your brine, but that you can't absolutely control the absorption rate, unless you use an equilibrium brine. Walt uses an equilibrium brine in his famous brined/injected recipe. You are using a gradient brine, which relies on time to control the absorption. It's not precise, and there's a lot of "black magic" in our gradient brine process. I gradient brine my butts and briskets, more for simplicity than anything else. But, I've also learned pretty good estimations of time. I use equilibrium brining for things like beef jerky, where I want very precise results every time, with no guess work.
Didn't mean to hijack your thread into a discussion on brining! But, since you asked... ;)
Hey Tony,
No worries, I post here to exchange ideas, recipes and hopefully gain some knowledge that would take years on my own. My goal is to also give back with some of the things I have learned over the years.
Thanks for the link I will take a look tomorrow and see what I can pick up.
Most important since this is not a competition smoke, the brisket really tasted good. The bark was good, it was tender and the salt level was spot on. Overall I would do this over and over again. The smoke ring..... well we both know this has nothing to do with the end result, but wow it was way too deep, but looked cool.
Thanks Greg
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Yay Greg! It looks great. Glad it tastes just as great. Brining and injecting is definitely a step up with smoking. It takes a little more understanding of the process, but ultimately gives fantastic results. Nice job!
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Greg,
To have a better understanding of the different brining processes, read this (if you haven't):
Brines 101 (http://smokinitforums.com/index.php?topic=1504.0)
What I mean by "controlling the salt" is not that you aren't measuring it for your brine, but that you can't absolutely control the absorption rate, unless you use an equilibrium brine. Walt uses an equilibrium brine in his famous brined/injected recipe. You are using a gradient brine, which relies on time to control the absorption. It's not precise, and there's a lot of "black magic" in our gradient brine process. I gradient brine my butts and briskets, more for simplicity than anything else. But, I've also learned pretty good estimations of time. I use equilibrium brining for things like beef jerky, where I want very precise results every time, with no guess work.
Didn't mean to hijack your thread into a discussion on brining! But, since you asked... ;)
Hey Tony,
I watched the videos on brining and while a bit dry, I did pick up some really good points.
While I don't use cola in a brine it was good to know that mixing curing salt with cola could form a lethal compound.
Thanks for saving.
Greg
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Yeah, the cola and cure was kind of off the wall - I actually forgot about that part! The main thing, to me, was learning a good understanding of the equilibrium brining technique. Using Martin's (Digging Dog Farm) calculator, it's crazy simple. It doesn't matter about time, either. If I'm brining jerky, I can leave it in for several days, if needed, and it will never get any saltier than it is at the point the brine penetrates all of the meat! That's what I really like....time not a factor, and consistency/control.