Author Topic: A couple questions  (Read 9441 times)

ofrankie

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A couple questions
« on: February 18, 2013, 10:41:15 AM »
I recently purchased the "Smokin-it' #2 ( I also have a Landmann propane unit).
The Smokin-it is very well made, well insulated, lots of smoke with relatively little wood - does seem to take a bit longer than the propane unit.
So far, I've smoked ribs twice on the unit & I have a couple issues:
1. the ribs did not seem to have the same smoke flavor as they did when cooked in the propane unit;
2. could not get the desired "smoke ring".
Does anyone have any ideas or suggestions?
Thanks

old sarge

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Re: A couple questions
« Reply #1 on: February 18, 2013, 12:00:06 PM »
I understand from reading this on a variety of sites that the smoke ring is a product of the curing process that occurs when burning wood, whether by itself or with propane. During the process, the wood burns releasing nitrates which being water soluble, penetrate the meat to a small depth creating a pink ring. Nitrates are typically used in the curing process.

I have also read that adding charcoal to the wood box in the smoker will release nitrates and will produce a smoke ring.  I do not know if that actually works or not.

I can send a couple of discussion links if you contact me.
David from Arizona
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ofrankie

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Re: A couple questions
« Reply #2 on: February 18, 2013, 02:09:06 PM »
Sarge -
thanks for your reply; any info you can put me on to would be appreciated.
Will also try being more precise with the amount of wood to get a heavier smoke flavor.
I did this yesterday & the outside temp was about 20deg - do you think that might have any effect?
Hopefully, Steve will see this & offer some suggestions.
Thanks again.

old sarge

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Re: A couple questions
« Reply #3 on: February 18, 2013, 07:09:17 PM »
PM Sent.  Not sure if it will help you or not.  Someday, when I'm experimenting, I am going to try smoking with JUST a piece of lump charcoal. Nothing fancy, maybe a single rack of ribs.
David from Arizona
US Army 70 - 95
SI 3D & Big Red Controller
CS 066
Lodge Sportsman Grill
Weber Kettle
Ducane Meridian 42 inch Grill
LEM MaxVac 1088A
LEM Big Bite #8 Grinder
Chef's Choice 665 and Rival Slicers
Old Hickory Knives
InstantPot Duo80 Plus

ofrankie

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Re: A couple questions
« Reply #4 on: February 19, 2013, 09:55:17 AM »
Sarge -
Received your info - thanx.
When (if) you decide to try the lump charcoal thing, I'd be curious to know how it turned out.
I think you'll still need to include some wood!

swthorpe

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Re: A couple questions
« Reply #5 on: February 25, 2013, 06:07:33 PM »
I have read on some web sites that electric smokers do not produce a smoke ring.
Steve from Delaware
Smokin-It #2

old sarge

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Re: A couple questions
« Reply #6 on: February 25, 2013, 06:57:03 PM »
You will not get a smoke ring with an electric smoker.  I am not up on the shemical processes that take place when smoking with a wood burner, but I suspect it has something to do with flame induced combustion, heat, and smoke.

Some folks will try using charcoal to coax a smoke ring while others will brine or soak in a curing medium to introduce nitrates to get the ring. I am not sure how all that works; I just want good smokey food.

If I can find an article, I will PM you.  Hope this helps.
David from Arizona
US Army 70 - 95
SI 3D & Big Red Controller
CS 066
Lodge Sportsman Grill
Weber Kettle
Ducane Meridian 42 inch Grill
LEM MaxVac 1088A
LEM Big Bite #8 Grinder
Chef's Choice 665 and Rival Slicers
Old Hickory Knives
InstantPot Duo80 Plus

Grimm5577

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Re: A couple questions
« Reply #7 on: February 26, 2013, 10:27:30 AM »
Sarge is correct, Here is some science to explain it all. (borrowed from http://www.karubecue.com/smoke_ring.html

The reddish "smoke ring" around the perimeter of a slice of Q comes from the combination of meat and fire:

From the meat: Myoglobin - a substance found in muscle.  It's a spherical protein with an iron-centered group attached.  What's bound to the iron atom determines the meat's color:

    Freshly killed and vacuum-packed meat has deoxymyoglobin (purple)
    Exposure to air forms oxymyoglobin (cherry red)
    Further air exposure forms metmyoglobin (brown)
    Exposure to nitric oxide produces nitric oxide myoglobin (bright red) and/or nitric oxide metmyoglobin (crimson).  These are the colors of a smoke ring

The globins denature at about 140F, fixing the colors.  So, the smoke ring forms in the initial hours of a cook, before the outer layer of the meat heats up.

From the fire: NOx Emissions - these come from high temperature combustion (2O2 + N2 --> 2NO2; 2NO2 --> 2NO + O2).  The NOx gases dissolve in the moist meat surfaces, forming nitric (HNO2) and nitrous (HNO3) acids that leach into the meat (3-8 mm, typically) and react with myoglobin.  Wood, charcoal, natural gas, and propane combustion all produce NO2, so a smoke ring can be made by most ovens.  Having no combustion, electric cookers won't make a ring by themselves.

Depth and intensity - for a bigger ring, you have 3 levers to pull:

    More myoglobin - beef has more than pork, which has more than fowl.  Old animals have more than young ones.  Recently killed animals have more.  Hardworking muscles have more than lightly-used ones.
    More NOx emissions - from a hot fire.  Wood combustion has the added benefits of producing lots of Fuel NOx (N2 from fuel) in addition to Thermal NOx (N2 from combustion air) and lots of water vapor for the NO2 to dissolve in.
    Longer exposure below 140F - load cold meat into the smoker (warning: you need a very clean fire to get away with this, as the cold meat will condense creosote from a dirty, smoldering fire).  Begin the smoke at a lower temperature (~200F) for the first hour or two, then raise it to your target cooking temperature.

Cheating - you can create or exaggerate a ring chemically by rubbing the meat with sodium nitrite curing salt (e.g., Tenderquick) before cooking.  Most competition rules prohibit the appearance of the smoke ring from influencing scores, because it's so easy to cheat this way.  But the smoke ring adds a lot to the presentation of the meat - authentically-prepared barbecue will have it and most connoisseurs expect to see it.

jimmybh

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Re: A couple questions
« Reply #8 on: May 25, 2013, 12:35:28 AM »
I have a smokin-it-3. I've been smokin for only a couple of months. I've smoked a lot of pork butt.My last smoke I brined for 72 hrs and increased the amount of apple wood to 4 ozs and about 1.5 ozs of hickery for 17 lbs of pork. This produced a great reddish pink hue to the outer edge with great flavor and moisture.