Smokin-It User Forum!
Alternative Cooking Methods to Go With the Smokin-It Smoker => Sous Vide! => Topic started by: id2nv2nj2ca on June 16, 2016, 04:31:50 AM
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In the three or four years that I have been smoking meats, Tri Tip is the only one I've done that........well.........sucked. I don't remember what I did, it's been that long ago, but I remember it didn't turn out well. At all. :(
So now that I have the Anova Sous Vide unit, I am wondering if I should incorporate it into the cooking process. Should I smoke, sous vide and then sear it or just smoke and then sear. Should brining be part of the process? My wife's boss' wife wants us to cater a birthday party for their daughter and they want baby back ribs, Tri Tip and our 12 cheese mac and cheese, but I am scared of the Tri Tip. I don't know yet how they like their meat temperature wise, but if we do this, how should we do it so it turns out good? I am, of course, going to get one and experiment to make sure we can pull it off, but would love some good ideas on how to turn out a nice, juicy, tender product.
Thanks in advance. :)
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Alright, Scott, if you're talking tri-tip, you're taking a trip down my alley in Santa Maria! ;) Check this out...foolproof, every time, and extremely tender and juicy tri-tip! The pinquito beans are good, too! No Anova required!
Santa Maria BBQ Night (http://smokinitforums.com/index.php?topic=4165.0)
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Alright, Scott, if you're talking tri-tip, you're taking a trip down my alley in Santa Maria! ;) Check this out...foolproof, every time, and extremely tender and juicy tri-tip! The pinquito beans are good, too! No Anova required!
Santa Maria BBQ Night (http://smokinitforums.com/index.php?topic=4165.0)
That sounds really great, thanks. I'm a bit worried about that IT, though. At least for the one we will try ahead of time to make sure it will turn out good for us. I'm thinking that would be bloody and as stated elsewhere, the Mrs. and I don't do bloody. She doesn't even really like pink, but I'm getting her there slowly. ;) Don't know what the boss and his wife likes yet.
What if I don't have oak? Red or otherwise? :) My choices now are Smokinlicious Wild Cherry, Hickory and Sugar Maple or Amazon Apple or Hickory.
Thanks so much. The beans sound great, but I have never even heard of them. Wonder if they are available at Restaurant Depot.
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Oh yeah, Scott...I forgot you guys don't do med-rare. I have a hard time comprehending not liking bloody beef, but that's just me, I guess! ;) Take it to medium-well, if you like, it will probably still taste good. That may be why it's your Achille's heel, though. :-[ Tends to toughen and dry meat.
I'd go with the hickory, if you don't have oak. I use red oak, from Smokinlicious, as it's traditional Santa Maria. The pinquito beans are only grown in a region of California, and I buy them from the Lompoc Bean Co. Not sure if RD will have them, and I would be surprised if they did. They are very unique. They have a firm skin, but a silky-smooth, buttery meat. Really, really good.
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Oh yeah, Scott...I forgot you guys don't do med-rare. I have a hard time comprehending not liking bloody beef, but that's just me, I guess! ;) It's definitely not just you. ;) Take it to medium-well, if you like, it will probably still taste good. That may be why it's your Achille's heel, though. :-[ Tends to toughen and dry meat. I wish I could remember what I did, but it's very possible that I cooked it too long.
I'd go with the hickory, if you don't have oak. I use red oak, from Smokinlicious, as it's traditional Santa Maria. The pinquito beans are only grown in a region of California, and I buy them from the Lompoc Bean Co. Not sure if RD will have them, and I would be surprised if they did. They are very unique. They have a firm skin, but a silky-smooth, buttery meat. Really, really good. Sure sounds like it!! :) Thanks again for the help.
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Scott, I forgot you were in SoCal, when I posted last night! The Santa Maria pinquito beans are only grown in the Santa Maria valley (to my knowledge), but I bet you can find them at specialty shops in the L.A. area. (I'm originally from Fullerton, btw). They are sold in 2 or 5 lb bags, from the Lompoc Bean Company, very reasonably, if you can't find them locally ($4.50/$9.00). Very good quality! lompocbeans.com
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Seems to me that taking tri-tip past medium-rare might be a problem. It is a pretty lean piece of meat, and is going to seize up and get tough the further it is cooked. It might not be the best cut to use for medium-well, but sounds like that is what was requested. Just make sure you slice it in the right direction and hope for the best.
I used the Anova for a tri-tip. I started by smoking it at 200° to an internal temperature of around 120, then vacuum sealed and put in the sous vide at 131° for four hours until my guests arrived. That gave me a nice tender medium-rare. It is a good way to hold it if you are not able to time it just right with your guests, like I couldn't that day. Just make sure you have it in the sous vide at 131 or higher for less than two hours, or more than 4 hours (nothing in-between) for food safety. You might want to put it in the sous vide at a higher temperature if you are going for medium, or god forbid...medium well.
From what I've researched, pinquito beans are a variety of pink beans, so if you have to substitute, pink beans would be the closest. But based on where you live, I would think you could find them. I ended up ordering pinquito beans from Lompoc. DM's bean recipe is the bomb! It's worth hunting down the real thing.
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Tony, that Santa Maria seasoning for the tri tip?.......FREAKING AWESOME!!! So good. Tempted to do that on the next 72 hour chuck roast. Did I say SO GOOD??
Kari, thank you. I "smoked" it at 200 until it reached 131 degrees, just 3 degrees more than Tony's recipe because we don't do bloody. The flavor of the seasoning was AMAZING, but I repeat myself. ;) The smoke flavor, nonexistent. The photos will show why.
After it hit the 131, I seared it in the gas grill and then started slicing after resting a bit. It was just a tad too bloody still, so I put it back in the smoker for about a half hour. It was still very pink and juicy, but just as chewy as it was when it first came out. Took it over to the wife's boss' house to see if they liked it, warning them about how chewy it was. Will be interesting to see what they think tomorrow. I love the idea of the sous vide treatment if that will tenderize it.
Thanks again for everything!! :)
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Tony, that Santa Maria seasoning for the tri tip?.......FREAKING AWESOME!!! So good. Tempted to do that on the next 72 hour chuck roast. Did I say SO GOOD??
Kari, thank you. I "smoked" it at 200 until it reached 131 degrees, just 3 degrees more than Tony's recipe because we don't do bloody. The flavor of the seasoning was AMAZING, but I repeat myself. ;) The smoke flavor, nonexistent. The photos will show why.
After it hit the 131, I seared it in the gas grill and then started slicing after resting a bit. It was just a tad too bloody still, so I put it back in the smoker for about a half hour. It was still very pink and juicy, but just as chewy as it was when it first came out. Took it over to the wife's boss' house to see if they liked it, warning them about how chewy it was. Will be interesting to see what they think tomorrow. I love the idea of the sous vide treatment if that will tenderize it.
Thanks again for everything!! :)
Here's a recent post for sous vide sirloin. Since tri-tip is from the bottom sirloin, this technique might work well for tenderizing tri-tip.
http://smokinitforums.com/index.php?topic=5062.0
I would smoke first to an internal temperature of 125 or so, then sous vide for 4-8 hours. You might try setting the sous vide bath to 135 since you like it a little more cooked. Then sear to your desired doneness. I've only made a couple tri-tips, but the direction you slice is SO important for tenderness. I had to research this, because the grain changes directions. Here's the video I used for slicing reference.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gmxHmuV4vTU
As far as your unburned wood, I noticed in an earlier post you were concerned about white smoke and possible combustion, so you were experimenting with wrapping the wood, lining the bottom of the smoke box with foil, etc. Might you still be doing that? That might cause a good quality wood with correct moisture not to light. Looks like nice smokinlicious wood you got there. Should do fine placing directly in the smoke box without any foil. Don't worry about what your smoke looks like unless you find that you are not happy with the smoke flavor of the final product. You are always going to see a heavier billowy white smoke when you start up your smoker because the element stays on as the smoker reaches temperature. Don't worry about it, it will even out as your smoker gets going. I have found no ill effects to this.
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Here's a recent post for sous vide sirloin. Since tri-tip is from the bottom sirloin, this technique might work well for tenderizing tri-tip.
http://smokinitforums.com/index.php?topic=5062.0
I would smoke first to an internal temperature of 125 or so, then sous vide for 4-8 hours. You might try setting the sous vide bath to 135 since you like it a little more cooked. Then sear to your desired doneness. I've only made a couple tri-tips, but the direction you slice is SO important for tenderness. I had to research this, because the grain changes directions. Here's the video I used for slicing reference.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gmxHmuV4vTU
As far as your unburned wood, I noticed in an earlier post you were concerned about white smoke and possible combustion, so you were experimenting with wrapping the wood, lining the bottom of the smoke box with foil, etc. Might you still be doing that? That might cause a good quality wood with correct moisture not to light. Looks like nice smokinlicious wood you got there. Should do fine placing directly in the smoke box without any foil. Don't worry about what your smoke looks like unless you find that you are not happy with the smoke flavor of the final product. You are always going to see a heavier billowy white smoke when you start up your smoker because the element stays on as the smoker reaches temperature. Don't worry about it, it will even out as your smoker gets going. I have found no ill effects to this.
Thanks so much for that video, Kari!! That's a big help, though I think I was slicing against the grain for the most part. I didn't think to cut it in half first.
I have another tri tip experiment in the smoker now and will follow your directions to the letter and see if I can't get a nice, tender and juicy piece of meat. I have a chuck roast in the sous vide now, but will add this for 4 hours and see what happens.
And yes, I was the one with the wood and smoke issues. It's hard to break the habit of worrying about achieving thin blue smoke as long as food tastes good. And you are also correct that the piece of wood in my photos was from smokinlicious and it did have foil in the smoke box. Foil has been removed this time around, so here's hoping it works like it should and last nights smoke didn't dry it so much that today it catches fire because it didn't have any barrier to that big 1500 watt element. ;)
Thanks again for the help, I really appreciate it.
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You might even want to go longer in your sous vide with the tri-tip, like 8 hours. You are right about reusing the wood from the previous smoking session. It might have sapped out the moisture. It'll probably still be fine. You could add an extra ounce or two of fresh wood if you are concerned. I still think tri-tip, anything beyond medium-rare, is going to be a challenge moisture and tenderness-wise, just because certain cuts of meat like sirlion, skirt steak, hanger steak, etc, are just fussy about the relationship between doneness and tenderness. Sous vide, by adding a third variable, "time", really helps level the playing field when it comes to that though. So I look forward to your results!
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You might even want to go longer in your sous vide with the tri-tip, like 8 hours. You are right about reusing the wood from the previous smoking session. It might have sapped out the moisture. It'll probably still be fine. You could add an extra ounce or two of fresh wood if you are concerned. I still think tri-tip, anything beyond medium-rare, is going to be a challenge moisture and tenderness-wise, just because certain cuts of meat like sirlion, skirt steak, hanger steak, etc, are just fussy about the relationship between doneness and tenderness. Sous vide, by adding a third variable, "time", really helps level the playing field when it comes to that though. So I look forward to your results!
Thank you!! Too late to change the wood situation now as I had already started the cook before my last post. After about 15 minutes, I had perfect TBS and now, NOTHING. No smoke at all. At least the seasoning tastes AMAZING. :)
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Scott, THANK YOU for the compliment about the SM seasoning! It's about as traditional as I could come up with, and tastes like I remember SM BBQ.
I know it's been covered, but smoking at 200, you definitely don't want to add foil to the wood or bottom of the smoke box. This is kind of a "low temp" smoke, so you shouldn't have a problem, especially with good wood!
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Scott, THANK YOU for the compliment about the SM seasoning! It's about as traditional as I could come up with, and tastes like I remember SM BBQ.
I know it's been covered, but smoking at 200, you definitely don't want to add foil to the wood or bottom of the smoke box. This is kind of a "low temp" smoke, so you shouldn't have a problem, especially with good wood!
For the tri tip I did yesterday, I used the chunk of hickory that didn't burn (or smolder) the day before and got no smoke from it at all. It got black all along the bottom of the piece of wood, that's it. And I also removed the tin foil from the smoke box completely. Guess I need to put it closer to one of my hot spots. Thanks again for all your help. :)
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I am perplexed by this. With the high wattage of the 4D, this seems odd. Especially with a previously used chunk that did not burn from a previous smoke session, which should have been pretty dry. Sounds like your element is not having any trouble getting you to your smoking temp? So not an issue with the element? I've missed some posts from the last couple months, and sometimes this forum can get so "overly" helpful with all sorts of advice, that I don't want to add any thoughts that might have been covered. DM has been monitoring this I'm sure. I'll let him chime in. He's the expert.
It seems that your earlier posts I read were related to too much white smoke, possible combustion, and concern that your wood was burning up too fast. But now it seems that you are having trouble getting your wood to burn at all, even after removing the foil from the bottom of the smoke box from earlier advice. Like I said, I have not seen every post, so I defer to others in this case. I do not have the big picture, and don't want to give suggestions that have already been given.
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I am perplexed by this. With the high wattage of the 4D, this seems odd. Especially with a previously used chunk that did not burn from a previous smoke session, which should have been pretty dry. Sounds like your element is not having any trouble getting you to your smoking temp? So not an issue with the element? I've missed some posts from the last couple months, and sometimes this forum can get so "overly" helpful with all sorts of advice, that I don't want to add any thoughts that might have been covered. DM has been monitoring this I'm sure. I'll let him chime in. He's the expert.
It seems that your earlier posts I read were related to too much white smoke, possible combustion, and concern that your wood was burning up too fast. But now it seems that you are having trouble getting your wood to burn at all, even after removing the foil from the bottom of the smoke box from earlier advice. Like I said, I have not seen every post, so I defer to others in this case. I do not have the big picture, and don't want to give suggestions that have already been given.
Thanks, Kari. Yes, I have received a LOT of different advice from different areas. Some via private message and others via the forum. Some said, because of the power of the element in the 4D, I should cover 3/4 of the smoke box with foil. Some said the wood doesn't matter at all, others say smokinlicious is the way to go. I was really baffled when the wood I had used the day before, when I did have foil in the smoke box, didn't smolder or burn yesterday after it had been subjected to heat the day before, didn't burn at all with no foil.
Just when I had resolved myself to listening to the people say "don't worry about the color of the smoke unless it's the really thick smoke indicating it caught on fire" and just setting it and forgetting it, now I'm not getting any smoke at all. And I don't want to put the wood over the actual hot spots that caused combustion. I'll eventually figure it all out. ;)
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People here are so darn helpful! You can get a lot of opinions. I would just go back to the basics, no foil, you've got the good smokinlicious wood, and get some smokes under your belt. I think you maybe overanalyzed the smoke appearance in the beginning during the seasoning process, which set you off on NUMEROUS paths prematurely. Lots of people look too closely at smoke and box temp during seasoning.
Tweak things from the basics. SI smokers really are so easy. You can get wrapped up in details, but it really is not necessary with these smokers to get GREAT results. If you come from a background of traditional smoking, you are used to analyzing these details. Just let it happen with the SI. It will do it's job.
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People here are so darn helpful! You can get a lot of opinions. I would just go back to the basics, no foil, you've got the good smokinlicious wood, and get some smokes under your belt. I think you maybe overanalyzed the smoke appearance in the beginning during the seasoning process, which set you off on NUMEROUS paths prematurely. Lots of people look too closely at smoke and box temp during seasoning.
Tweak things from the basics. SI smokers really are so easy. You can get wrapped up in details, but it really is not necessary with these smokers to get GREAT results. If you come from a background of traditional smoking, you are used to analyzing these details. Just let it happen with the SI. It will do it's job.
You're so right and I appreciate all the people that try to help, even though they sometimes contradict each other. It's definitely a learning process for sure.
This weekend, I have to do the two tri tips and 3 racks of ribs for a birthday party. I think I'm going to smoke the tri tips for a couple of hours and then sous vide them for at least 5 hours so they are tender. Thanks again for that video link on cutting a tri tip!! And then throw the ribs on for 5 1/2 hours or so, until done. My wife gets the pleasure of putting together the 12 cheese mac and cheese. A half pan for the birthday party and a half pan for someone else. ;) Sadly, we have to do this while preparing to go to Idaho to bury my mom who passed away yesterday morning. But, life goes on, right? :)
Thanks again for all the help, I really appreciate it.
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Sadly, we have to do this while preparing to go to Idaho to bury my mom who passed away yesterday morning.
Sorry to hear about your mom. :(
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So sorry to hear of your loss, Scott! Blessings to you, and yours.
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Sadly, we have to do this while preparing to go to Idaho to bury my mom who passed away yesterday morning.
Sorry to hear about your mom. :(
Thank you!!! We thought we were going to lose her a couple of years ago. The doctors were convinced, but she rallied, so it wasn't unexpected.
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So sorry to hear of your loss, Scott! Blessings to you, and yours.
Thanks, Tony. Appreciate it. :)
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I'm sorry to hear about your Mom Scott. Blessings to you and your family.
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I'm sorry to hear about your Mom Scott. Blessings to you and your family.
Thank you so much, Gregg. I appreciate it.